And when we're done helping cleaning up the mess, let's remember to eliminate the government programs/actions that caused the mayhem:

http://tiadaily.com/php-bin/news/showArticle.php?id=1026

I have already sent what financial assitance I can to the Red Cross. It doesn't make me particularly happy that most of the aftermath was largely avoidable.

WE NEED TO MAKE MAJOR DRASTIC SERIOUS CHANGES IN THE GOVERNMENT.

After a few weeks, the state parties might want to contact the state parties in Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana and see if it would be helpful if we made donations to those three state parties.

But this isn't the highest priority right now.

Major, drastic, serious changes in the government you say? that sounds new and promising, don't know if anyone's tried that before. But first I would propose a new and serious drastic change in typing. I recommend releasing the caps lock and completing your train of thought, for starters.

KATRINA: Blame 'Game' IS Needed and NOW!

Your tax dollars were NOT 'at work' to be effective in meeting the challenge of Katrina!

While disaster needs continue, 'Homeland (in)Security' top officials publicly excuse themselves from immediate scrutiny. 'Don't bother us with this now as we're busy' But, the same inept officials holding on to their phony baloney jobs are STILL sabotaging salvation efforts by imposing their intolerable bureaucretinism upon front line heroes. Watching news accounts and the Sunday morning public policy national TV shows made it excruciatingly clear that these political hacks were made for firing. They are NOT up to challenges like Katrina and her on going aftermath.

As Bob Schieffer of CBS 'Face the Nation' said this past Sunday morning: if the last few days are examples of disaster response, we need to start over!

MoreAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TerryLiberty/message/141

Aaron Broussard, president of Jefferson Parish, just south of New Orleans, told NBC's Meet the Press:

"It's not just Katrina that caused all these deaths in New Orleans," Broussard said. "Bureaucracy has committed murder here in the greater New Orleans area....."

NBC Meet the Press: the ongoing crisis of Katrina

Public official breaks down in tears as Tim Russert hosts

WindowsMedia Download/Playback
http://txliberty.dyndns.org/inetpub/wwwroot/webfiles/NBCMTP050904Lo.wmv

KATRINA: Austin Community Inspires!

Can you help Katrina Victims?

There has been such a surge of help of all kinds from Austinites that co-ordinators are now encouraging consideration for the need in a few days and a few weeks to relieve today's volunteers.

Feel the love :)

MuchMoreAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TerryLiberty/message/140

We've been having a good response with our blood drive in Pinellas, Florida:
http://www.LPPinellas.org

Here is a food for thought, while as Libertarians we want freedom from the government, because it seems with all the beaurocracy some of those who want to help others in a time of crisis are either interfered with or outright prevented from accomplishing this. Is there some kind of conflict here?

I agree with sending the military in to assist with this national tragedy. The response should have gone smoother and the city of New Orleans should have been cleared out of those who were willing to leave in a more orderly fashion.
One way I feel that I can help in the long term in addition to monetary donations is to become an advocate of legalized gaming in my state (Alaska) to provide jobs for some of the victims who are also experienced casino employees. Long shot maybe but I feel it would be win-win for any state that is willing to take a gamble on casinos in their state.

I am in Mobile, here are my thoughts. It is long, but perhaps useful to those who are intersted.

**

ORGANIZATIONS THAT CAME THROUGH

The Salvation Army
Which according to the Mayor of New Orleans, “ they just do”. The next day, they had already set up and were serving hot meals in front of their demolished office in New Orleans. All of this despite the fact that the Red Cross insisted it was impossible to get into the area.

Allstate Insurance
When they claim they are the ‘good hands people’, they really are. They could be seen around town helping others.

Wal-Mart
Another organization who was in New Orleans & Biloxi the next day…again, despite the fact that the Red Cross said you couldn’t get into the area. They donated trucks filled with items and hired people on the spot who were left unemployed.

Shoe Station
A chain store in the Southern US. They donated over 20,000 pairs of shoes within days.

Banking Institutions & Credit Unions
You will hear that there is no way a disaster like this could have been prepared for (Gov. organizations). However, private organizations did have master plans in place. The banking industry had an emergency network that went into effect right away.

Local Churches
Know that goods that you donated to your local churches have been received and distributed appropriately. They run circles around the Feds.

ORGANIZATIONS THAT WERE A WASTE

FEMA

#1
Their Rep explained that they could take names but couldn’t help a homeowner, unless the homeowner was willing to meet the FEMA Rep at their home. You, of course, must make an appt. How you will get to your home just isn’t explained.

#2
The FEMA big wig explained why he wasn’t doing anything to help—He was waiting on the Gov. to call and tell him what needed to be done. Uh…there are no phones you ding dong!

#3
In Baton Rouge, those who had fled the hurricane in advance were kicked out of a private hotel by FEMA to make room for their own Reps (staying in non air conditioned facilities is apparently beneath them).

#4
Various offices shut down because their own regulations allot only a certain number of people to be helped per year.

#5
FEMA declared certain areas ‘clear’ (such as downtown New Orleans) when people were calling in from their cell phones to radio stations days later saying they were trapped in buildings. These were hundreds of people. Hundreds.

RED CROSS

#1
Red Cross centers in Northern AL are telling people fleeing the damage to come back in a week.

#2
Offices (at least here in AL) have closed their doors—they are out of ‘client cards’. Perhaps only ‘official’ client cards can be used. The media in Huntsville explained that this was a good thing since that way everyone will be treated the same (equally rejected, I assume). This organization is getting millions in donations. Millions. No one seems to want to question them.

OTHER REGULATIONS THAT ARE A HINDRANCE

#1
No Child Left Behind Act. Many of these children are coming from impoverished areas with poorly performing schools. Their standardized testing will follow them. Any school taking in these children will no longer be ‘highly qualified’. Communities will then be punished for helping.

#2
Problems with interstate licensing of medical personnel. A team of Dr.’s and surgeons (300) came from my area to New Orleans to help with disease & other medical conditions. They even had their own 116 bed mobile office. They were able to get within miles, but were stopped. They were not licensed in Louisiana. Even with a note from the Gov., they were denied access to the people.

#3
Prevention of out of towners to access the area. There are people in the affected areas whose family/friends from out of state are willing to load up moving trucks & help them. This is not permitted. These people must first move their goods outside the city limits then someone can help them.

SUGGESTIONS

#1
If you want to donate, please consider donating goods vs. money. There is less chance that this type of donation will be ‘diverted’ for other uses. Some legal (going to other projects), some not so legal (such as thugs stealing the donations at gunpoint).

#2
Please write your Congressmen to have FEMA removed from Homeland Security and be independently operated (if at all).

#3
Please write your Congressmen to have all high ranking FEMA officials fired immediately. Please also demand why they have spent their resources, time and money on promotional rap songs (available on their web sites)

#4
If you support No Child Left Behind, please write your Congressmen/Pres. To have this suspended in the affected areas. Communities should not be punished for helping.

#5
Do not donate to the Red Cross & urge your employers to find other organizations. The Red Cross has proven itself over and over again to be questionable in regards to its money management & policies:

World War II
The Red Cross raised money for ‘our boys’ then charged the GI’s for their own packages. Just ask a WWII vet what they think of the Red Cross. As my grandfather put it, “they even charged me for a lousy cup of coffee”. They claim they had no choice, but to charge but somehow again the Salvation Army never charged a dime.

HIV Testing
The Red Cross continued to distribute blood they knew was tainted—infecting who knows how many. They continued to have blood drives in communities known to have high HIV infection rates. They refused to test the blood for many years—even today they resist testing for Lyme disease (something that affects me).

Oklahoma City Bombing
The Red Cross is still in the courts on this one. Local Red Cross officials had victims PERSONAL mail sent to their office—where they then opened the mail and took money. Their reasoning was that since the Red Cross was helping these families, they were not entitled to outside help. It is a federal crime to open mail that does not belong to you.

9/11
There again money was raised. There is still a question if all the money was distributed.

*There are plenty of other organizations out there who do not have questionable management practices. Find one. Even if your company offers matching funds for Red Cross donations. 1 dollar well spent is worth more than 2 dollars wasted.

#6
Please write your congressmen/ Pres. To promote Lt. Gen. Russel Honore, commander of the 1st Army, based at Fort Gillem in Atlanta
to 4 stars. He had the mess in New Orleans under control in a matter of hours!!

#7
Write the Gov. of Louisiana, Mayor of New Orleans, Police Chief, and Congressmen of Louisiana demanding to know why innocent men, women, & children were moved to a ‘shelter’ where there was no food, water, or security. Armed gunmen were allowed to prowl. These gunmen shot men, stole from the elderly, and systematically raped the women throughout the day and night (their screams could be heard but there no one to help them—those who tried were shot dead). Please demand that the police officers that abandoned their posts, and those that engaged in criminal activity (such as stealing jewelry) not be rehired under any condition.

Also, I did want to add that there as been a question as to why people did not leave. For many it was lack of transportation, for the others it also was a matter of no hotel rooms open. You see…it is football season. Many of the rooms were pre-booked. My father, in MS, had to go to Missouri to find a room.

KARA TYSON BEAUTIFUL POST. PEOPLE WE NEED to make drastic changes, now is the time for drastic changes to step in and really bring up why we need to make drastic changes.
Wal-Mart tried to come in to give neccessities to these people and they were turned away.
I am also very skeptical of the Red Cross as my fiance and I do not care for them.
WE THE PEOPLE not THE GOVERNMENT AND WHATS in it for them.

I would like to comment, those armed men who engaged in criminal activity, rather then not be hired, should be in jail for life for rape and stealing. Can there be a lawsuit against the organization for this happening because some of those people were better off to band together like some of the people who tribed together rather then rely on the government or other organization who jailed these people and degraded them and treated them like cattle.
NOW AMERICA WAKE UP. WE ARE A BUNCH OF CATTLE.

My father was in the army in San Fransico in 1941. His pay was $21 a month. The Paymaster would hand him $19 and give $2 to the Red Cross person sitting next to him. They forced my father to make a $2 donation before he was paid. My father never donated to the Red Cross the rest of his life and I would not donated to them either.
There is a saying in my house," When the Red Cross finally shows up the Salvation Army is there to help them off the bus".

Pouring tainted water into the lake, river and then let it flow into the Gulf will be Much More a catastropht disaster than the hurricane. This is the Death of govt. Free thinkers may arise. toxic waste in water = dead small creatures -->dead fish, no food
gotta go back to work

The governments of New Orleans and Louisiana had 40 years worth of opportunities to fix the problems involving the levees. The city of New Orleans and the state of Louisiana obviously didn't raise and set aside all of the money necessary to help fix the levees. Now it's going to cost alot more to fix this mess than it would have if it was fixed earlier. The negligence, lack of efficiency, and outright corruption has cost New Orleans and the rest of Louisiana an extraordinary amount of money and human lives. They should also be blamed for failing to properly evacuate so many people and instead saved their own hides. I understand that some chose to stay in New Orleans, but they were stupid to reject the chance to escape the storm.

Others who need to be severely taken to task is the Bush Administration for sending a significant portion of the National Guard over to Iraq and Afghanistan. If the National Guard wasn't over there, then there would've been more manpower needed to evacuate the areas hit by the hurricane. They would've been able to do so more quickly and in a more organized manner.

Why does it seem to me that the governments of Alabama, Mississippi, and others did a much better job in preparing for the hurricane and evacuating their people than did Louisiana?

I have to disagree with that National Guard argument. I think Louisiana had 8,000 out of 10 or 12,000 national guard troops still in Lousiana, which would be most of their troops by far. It was a far bigger problems of logistics than it was numbers.

I think a large majority of national guard forces nationwide are still in the nation, not in Iraq and Afghanistan. More troops does not necesarrily equal more speed.

Oh, and another goodie for you. For those who saw Ms. Condi Rice on tv..the community she was in is called Bayou La Batre. It is a cajun and Vietnamese community. Literally dirt poor.

The food distribution center was closed (and the food removed) after she left.

The city asked FEMA for 1500 temporary shelters...FEMA says they can have 500. But they arent here yet...of course!!

**
I need to go to the FEMA website in advance next time. That way I can download the FEMA rap song and listen to it over and over while I color in my FEMA coloring book (which is also available on the web site).

I see the snakes coming out of the woodwork to assign blame. Nancy Pelosi and the rest of the worms pointing the blame at President Bush.

The REAL blame sits about 70% on the Mayor of New Orleans and 30% on the Governor of Louisana. This incompentent mayor failed in any way to carry out the cities emergency evacuation plan. For this, he deserves to be removed from office and put on trial for at the very least, 10,000 counts of negligent homicide and very possibly, voluntary manslaughter. This should also apply to all the members of his administration. As for the governor, her response to the crisis was far from adequate and at the very least, she should be impeached and removed from office for gross mismanagement and possibly face some sort of charges as well.

As for the President of the United States. It is not an enumerated power of the Federal Government to deal with emergencies of this type, so by constitutional principle, it is impossible for him to bear any of the blame for this situation whatsoever.

Of course, all this matters not to the democrats and the race baiters. All they care about is making political points at the expense of the dead.

The Libertarian response to this situation should be:

1. Abolish FEMA.

2. Make it clear to the states that it is the states sole responsibility to deal with these disasters.

3. One way the feds can help, is by eliminating unconstitutional federal spending, freeing that revenue for use by the states in disaster preparedness.

Let's not forget the Army Corps of Engineers, who (correct me if I'm wrong) owned/controlled the levees around the city. As others have pointed out, there has been years, if not decades, of studies that predicted this scenario in the event of a large hurricane.

This was not "the perfect storm", an unpredictable and extravagently unlikely occurence, as Michael Chertoff is struggling to get people to think. It was a hurricane; they happen several times a year, every year. The city of New Orleans and/or the state of Louisiana should have control over their levees and dams. The Army Corps, along with a parade of other federal players, have proven themselves completely inept.

That is another point.

The Army Corps of Engineers, and all similar military entities, should be immediately abolished, as they have no relevent purpose in modern warfare, and the Army has no business engaging in civilian activities. Any necessary engineering functions required by the army should be conducted by civilian engineers.

I think it perfectly acceptable for a Libertarian to be angry at the Feds on this.

We may not believe that it is the duty of the Feds to provide disaster relief, however they have demanded that responsibility.

At this time (unless something changes) the ball is in their court. They wanted it--they got it. They have been paid through taxpayer money to provide a service--so provide it!!

Damn Mark. You love that word abolish.

Have you ever figured out that as libertarians, or Republicans, or Democrats, no one ever has the absolute authorization to "abolish" anything?

Ever heard of checks and balances?

I am the first person to blame Mothers Against Drunk Driving for suffering and death in the Crescent City Holocaust. http://StopTheMADDness.org

And my other website, which gets serious traffic, urges people to donate: http://periodicos.ws

Another Libertarian solution: Tell reporters to charter a bus from Jackson, Mississippi to a Red Cross shelter further south, round trip, bringing people from the overcrowded shelter without electricity to a place further away, and in exchange for the cost, getting dozens of exclusive interviews.

Timothy West:

Democrats and Republicans had no authority to establish FEMA, Social Security, Medicare or any of the thousands of unconstitutional departments, agencies and mandates in the first place. They are unconstitutional. They are illegal. Every day they continue to exist, is a day the Constitution is being used as a s**trag.

I am well aware of the concept of checks and balances, a lot more aware of a lot of other constitutional concepts, such as enumerated powers, powers reserved to the states, etc, ad nauseum.

I use the word abolish in its proper constitutional sense. I am not suggesting by presidential decree. I am suggesting by either the route of abolition by act of Congress or by the route of having the courts declare said agencies unconstitutional.

But which of these two routes are taken, the action needs to be swift. Every day these agencies exist, the Constitution of the United States is befouled and held in contempt. I despise these agencies and will accept nothing short of their total elimination and the goal of returning the Federal Government to its proper enumerated powers and to the role of limited government.

<<Democrats and Republicans had no authority to establish FEMA, Social Security, Medicare or any of the thousands of unconstitutional departments,

Actually, in strict application of libertarian principles, it wasn't the government's job to evacuate people in the first place. The real wrongdoing was in turning away trucks carrying relief supplies, unconstitutionally detaining people at the Convention Center and Super Dome, and then using violent force to evacuate people against their will (which made the problem worse because those cops could have been arresting looters instead.)

There would be a lot more housing in areas near New Orleans if it weren't for zoning ordinances. The law of supply and demand, not the law of Kenner, would limit construction, and there'd be a higher vacancy rate and lower rents as a result.

<<Here is a food for thought, while as Libertarians we want freedom from the government, because it seems with all the beaurocracy some of those who want to help others in a time of crisis are either interfered with or outright prevented from accomplishing this. Is there some kind of conflict here?

The legitimate function of the government is to secure the rights of the people. The government failed, as looting and rapes happened with impunity.

Furthermore, gun-toting government goons turned back trucks laden with emergency supplies.

Furthermore, the government shut off power to millions of people by giving a protected monopoly to private companies that used power lines not designed to handle windy, rainy nights like that one.

LP Membership card #000146792

Why help? FEMA is handing out $2000 debit cards.

UGH!!!

Mark,

Let me know when you come out of that dream you are in. You can be as right as rain and you'll never come a inch closer to getting any of that stuff done unless the LP starts practicing the art of the possible, politically speaking.

Can you come up with a politically possible first step towards getting rid of on those things you mentioned? How are you going to cope with negotating with the R's and D's so they will vote to do this stuff?

If the LP cant answer those questions, they dont deserve the offices they claim to be seeking. You dont "abolish" anything in America. You can write a bill or propose a course of action, but you have to get other people who are not libertarians to vote for your bills, assuming you got enough non-libertarians to vote for you so you could get into office in the first place. To do that, you usually have to make a deal, or lots of deals. Thats the truth of it. The only way you dont have to cut deals is if you have a super majority, then, you can do what you damn well please. Until then, we are in no position to abolish anything, whichever way you want to use the term.

Knowing about government structure, the Constitution, and so on, is not the same thing as knowing about politics. The LP needs to learn about the art of politics now more than all the static documents. It's a political party.

The LP has to win the votes of people who ARE NOT LIBERTARIANS in order to get elected to anything. Thats means we have to appeal to enough D's, R's, and Independants who vote in the first place for us. Until we can do that, it really doesnt matter what you want to abolish. You'll never get the chance.

Have you ever actually run for office?

It just irks me that so many LP members use that word as if it meant something in the political sense. It doesnt. It's just another LP buzzword that makes libertarians feel good about themselves. Like Statist. Means absolutely nothing outside the LP. A useless label to the outside world.

A "normal" non-libertarian person, who you would probably call a sheeple, would be scared to death of you, and they would never vote for you. Is'nt that a clue to you?

Mark,

Here's some light reading for you. :D

http://libertyforsale.com/2005/03/22/top-5-most-overused-words-by-libertarians/

WE cannot win for losing, Yes, UGH to $2000.00 debit cards, we give donations in hopes none get pocketed by some of these organizations. Then these people get more money from debit cards, and a logical guess they will tax us some more to pay for this whether we like it or not. I do not doubt some people who were not hurt by this will also get the some share of the money as well.
Sure let them take the money and give it, keep giving it, more, more, more. Like there is no tommorrow. Oh in due time the Government will give themselves another fat raise.
Who knows what kind of deficit we have now.

TIRED OF BENDING OVER!!!

There's a FEMA coloring book? Cool.

Does it feature innocent children rushing into the sheltering arms of noble governmental agents while scenes of destruction ravage the world around them?

Someone has been reading their Orwell

I myself am wondering when these people will start demanding they receive as much money as the 9/11 families(average of 1.3 million I believe). The main difference here being that 9/11 was a foreign attack on our country which the government is responsible for stopping ahead of time, so they hold some liability there, while this is a natural disaster that the government has no control or power over.

I’d like to know under what authority these debit cards could possibly be issued. Has the Constitution been suspended? When did Congress authorize this? Does FEMA have a slush fund for this purpose?

Restoration of law and order, rescuing citizens from an immediate danger, emergency health care and transportation are all arguably functions of federal government. Providing assistance to local governments toward protecting property from damage or further damage is arguably a function of federal government. But no matter how expedient it might be, issuing disaster aid and charity is not a function of the federal government. Issuing disaster aid and charity is a function of private aid organizations, which are in a much better position to determine and provide for immediate needs during a crisis.

These debit cards are blatant theft from the US Treasury. How much more immoral and disgusting does our government have to get before people take notice?

Here is where you can play the 'get FEMA Freddy home safely game': http://www.fema.gov/kids/games/maze/

Here's a coloring book. It gives great insightful advice for flooding..such as 'move away from water' (I never thought of that):
http://www.fema.gov/kids/games/colorbk/original_color4.htm

Jeez... The "art of the possible"...

If weak knees had been all the rage in the Soviet Union in 1990, it never would have collapsed in 1991.

I am so tired of nattering naysayers who think they know it all -- but who do little.

Those who think Libertarianism Lite should be our official position should start up their own local LP in their own county, city, or town, arranged along that philosophy, and prove their claims. But they won't do that because then they'd actually have to do some work.

As an example, let's say that one of these self-styled "political experts" lives in a town called Dry Gulch, West Slobovia. Is there a town Libertarian committee there? Does this "political expert" attend town meetings, or meetings of the nearby County government?

Doubtful.

These folks are do-nothings. Even if they succeed in remaking the LP in their flawless, godlike image, they will remain, contentedly, on their couch, whining about everyone else's faults.

Give me a break.

Quit the carping, and go do some work rather than telling everyone else how stupid they are for doing things differently than you would (assuming you could unglue yourself from the couch).

The rest of us should feel free to completely and utterly ignore these "experts".

Eponym, the debit card thing was just proposed by the Bush administration and is being rushed through, and will be expected to pass this weekend. It's bad, but don't worry, no suspending of the constitution(at least no more than usual).

Rushed through congress that is. Wish there was an edit button.

I was waiting for you. What took you so long?

I wasnt a do nothing when I ran for office here in 2000. I gave out, singlehandedly, 7K+ 3 way brochure distributed by HAND at every house in my city. I got on the radio, twice, 1 hour each time. I got in the paper, circulation 35K. I ran a half page ad times 2. The National LP was in every ad along with me.

I now give a 300 dollar a year pledge to the LP, 25 a month. I gave somewhere around 250 bucks to Badnarik. I gave hundreds to Harry Browne in 96 and 2000. I've voted for Libertarian candidates every time they have run since Andre Marrou. I've since given small amounts to most of the current candidates and over 200 bucks to various LP ballot access drives for 2006 in the past 6 months alone.

I write about the LP on my blog which is currently pulling 600 visits ( not hits ) a day. I write 2 to 3 posts a day about the LP or LP related actions. I've got a application into the zoning commission for a vacancy appointment so I can apply myself inside local government. Pending as I write.

How about you tell me what you are doing? You might be doing more, or you might be doing less, but I do what I do, which does not amount to nothing. There is no local LP here, and the nearest West Virginia group is 200 miles away in Morgantown. Bit far to go to meetings.

Post your list of accomplishments. If they are more than mine, I will tip my hat. If they are less, then work harder. You have to catch up to the level of a do-nothing. :D

Actually, I think fighting on this blog about who has personally done more for the LP is childish and embarrassing. It's also irrelevant to the debate about how the party could be more successful.

I also think posting statements like "The Constitution is being used as a s**trag" or "Tired of Bending Over" is disgraceful. We're all passionate about the cause, but this is a public forum. Have some class.

Jon,

When directly addressed, I address the addresser. :D

If they are right, I consider that I may not know as much as I think I do. If wrong, I rejoice that I am still ahead of them. :D

Relax. It takes all kinds.

JON THERE IS class, just right to the point because some people do not have a clue until it is bluntly said.
TIM WEST your English is abominable

Here is a good link for you to look at regarding FEMA.

http://www.rense.com/general67/femwont.htm

Sorry, I trade on my West Virginia hillbily status every so often when I rite.....or is that right? :D

<<Restoration of law and order, rescuing citizens from an immediate danger, emergency health care and transportation are all arguably functions of federal government.

"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of then against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence."

U.S. Constitution, Article IV sec. 4.

<<Providing assistance to local governments toward protecting property from damage or further damage is arguably a function of federal government. But no matter how expedient it might be, issuing disaster aid and charity is not a function of the federal government.

Just a convenient way to get rid of winos and crack heads by handing them two thousand dollars.

Next time, the disaster will happen in Ontario and people will suffer and perish waiting in line at the U.S. border because their passports are soaked and illegible.

An inability to grasp plain english is an unfortunate thing. The suggestion was for wannabe experts to start up a local LP if there isn't one nearby. In response, the whining begins about how the nearest local LP committee is far away. That certainly answered a question that was never asked.

Yes, comparisons are generally sophomoric. I didn't bring it up. Nevertheless, some experts have yet a long way to go.

A one-time, splash-in-the-pan try for public office doesn't make someone an expert on political organizing.

Getting a whopping total of 3.5% out of 6832 votes does not qualify one as an expert.

Raising 2.6% of $23,929 in contributions ($644) in one election cycle does not make one an expert -- especially when that entire 2.6% came from the candidate, and one family member.

Instead of looking back on one's own failures and attempting to shift blame for them on others one deems "less perfect", maybe one should look back on how one could have done things differently.

There have been other LP volunteers who have been much more effective. There used to be a Libertarian Victory Fund, which managed to select several winning candidates to support with funding. In one year, they supported 9 candidates and 7 of them won. Notably, the expert's campaign wasn't among the ones the fund supported.

Over several years, there was a management team called the Troika, which supported several winning candidates also. Notably, the expert's campaign wasn't one of them, either.

What we need is fewer experts and more workers.

Flash-in-the-pan campaigns - which start out with an unprepared candidate who doesn't raise any money, who has invested no time in building a local LP support network over several years, who isn't active in his own community and is therefore completely unknown, and which predictably finish with lackluster results - are not particularly useful to the LP.

Only hard work works.

Step away from the computer, get off the couch and put away the video games, and invest some effort before presuming to tell others how to do their jobs and how stupid they are for saying things differently than you do.

JUST OUT--NEWS FROM MOBILE
FEMA officials in New Orleans have been caught looting.

Hm. I had heard of some looting by officials, but mainly it was looting of ammunition so that nobody else could loot it and be able to use guns(I'm for people being able to use guns, but only if they actually own it).

What I am taking about is the stealing of women's nighties (cant figure out that one), and various other goods.

This was separate from the Fascist stealing of guns from private gun owners.

They are coming to your home, if you dont agree to turn over your guns (or have your home searched), then you are arrested. If you willingly give them your guns, you are not arrested.

Well now there is a story on guns being confiscated. So now we have our guns taken. Thats Amerika for you.
One one hand, eminent domain, the other hand guns, change in mj, guess we are following the 1930's. I guess people here is not going to get up and do something until we are locked in our homes like cattle. Our money is helping people who are going to throw it away on drugs, we the tax payers are going to pay for it. The illegals are afraid to help help as they claim there are enough of them living there. To bad the Government are so concerned about making democracy in other countries except Mexico. Mexico has a lot of land and it could be set up so the illegals do not want to come here. Our money is being taken and used in Mexico. I may as well live on welfare, my wages are not far from it now.
But like I said, we are just a bunch of movable cattle that will if not already be branded.

In respect to the other users of the blog I wont respond to you again after today.

Of course, since you never responded to my question to show me your list of great doings that you are responsible for or never answered my question about running for office yourself, I have to assume I've done more than you have, or you quickly would have answered those questions to shut me up....right?

I sent out a fundraising letter to every LP member in the county, once before I ran, once after I started. I got exactly 2 replies, one at the county fair where I had a tent set up and was campaining (sic) with our Governors candidate, Bob Myers which netted us a appearance on Hagerstown, Md's NBC 25 TV on the news for that day. Neither person actually sent me money - they just wanted me to know there was a LP guy in the race.

I made every novice mistake one could learn doing that race. Every one of them. It might interest you to know I was MUCH more "pure" in 2000 than I am today. I bet you would have supported me in every way. It was that experience that made me start questioning the LP's platform and general basis for fielding candidates in the first place.

There was an attempt ( not by me, though I was invited ) to organize a local LP about 8 months ago right in my county. Letters were sent out to every registered libertarian in the county. The meeting was on a Wed. night at a local resturant. There was a grand total of ONE (1) couple that showed up. There are around 70 libertarians registered in my county.

Frankly, my area seems to be a death trap for libertarians. All the efforts to do anything here have failed for years, and I have to admit I dont know why.

You know you're not the first guy to look up my stats on the WVSOS site, right? It may interest you to know that the first offical tally showed me with 630 votes and running as a (L), while the "Official" tally later on showed me with the exact results you mentioned, and it also shows me incorrectly running as a write in candidate! I have written the SoS twice to ask why this happened and have never gotten a reply. They dont feel it's worth persuing I guess.

Until the LP can afford to buy the same actual political experts the R's and D's use for a few hundred dollars a hour, you will have to be satisfied with guys like me. The funniest thing about your attacks on me is that I have never claimed to any any sort of political expert of any kind, but you seem really upset that I might be taken seriously. I blog and give my opinions about what needs to be done. People either agree with me or they dont. You dont.

That does not bother me as much as you think it does. If you dont have a opposition, you are not having a impact. I must be doing something somewhere, enough to upset you, in any case. I've managed to upset some poeple so much they are sending me death threats. That would be pretty sicko if I find out they are coming from LP members. It's under criminal investigation.

Answer me here if you want, but this is the last you'll hear from me. It's gone on long enough already.

I'm surprised you don't have more earning power, True American, considering your educated and insightful comments on this blog.

I'm so glad a Libertarian was able to work in a swipe at Mexico on a thread about US disaster relief.

JON I just made a statement, this doesn't have to be directed at me per say to make a point. Obviously you didn't have clue. What I have or do not have is of no one business, but the point I made obviously didn't get through.

I would like to comment, I made suggestions, I have donated money and goods. Hopefully my money will be used and not pocketed. But alas, I would have to say I think New Orleans should not be rebuild in a obviously prone area and moved to higher grounds. I expect there will be more disasters to come and soon this country will be out of money, as well as our freedom all lost.
I have also made good suggestions on getting the word out to put Libertarians in office which we so desperately need. Now is a good time for the sake of our freedom. But alas I don't believe it going to happen.

Somebody just dug through the Congressional Record, and found that Senator Mary Landrieu of Louisana deliberately diverted federal funding away from levee maintanance to her pet pork projects. Fascinating that the press can't seem to interrupt their lynching of the administration long enough to point out that Louisana's own Senator's contributed to the death count.

Yep, you can't win votes for levy maintenance.

CK OUT LANCE BROWN FOR PRESIDENT 2008

I would be happy to donate to the party for the sole purpose of restoring and/or improving LP operations in the region, and I would encourage everyone else to donate to the party instead of to the "charitable" organizations listed on these pages. Anyone residing in a place where the police state is threatening to take away everyone's guns except those in the hands of a government agent needs an LP office more than they need shoes or anything else.

The government, through its corrupt actions and later through its inaction, created most of the problems that exist down there now. I'll be damned if I am going to donate one penny towards helping them save face in that regards. The average American who does whatever the talking heads on TV tell them to will donate plenty of money and stuff to the Red Cross and other similar swindles to provide for the needs of the victims. I would much rather keep my assistance in the party where it will do more good for more people.

Al Gore knew a Dr. in New Orleans, and then paid for 2 airplanes to go in and rescue 270 patients from the hospitals, so they could get medical care elsewhere.

You guys posting here are so used to bashing Democrats and Republicans. Do you wonder why Libertarians lose elections?

What you focus on expands.

Try this: praise everyone who rescued or helped someone in this tragedy.

Go further: Be a visionary! Find a way to help, rescue, assist, inspire or enrich someone. Do that all the time!

If the Libertarian Party truly wants to be a Visionary Party that creates and delivers great solutions for ALL the people of the US, then individual libertarians---stop the name calling and the stereotyping.

There are many people of many different political situations trying to do the BEST for all the people who were in the Hurricane Katrina area.

Be a Liberating Visionary! (Not a name caller!)

EXPERT SEZ: "In respect to the other users of the blog I wont respond to you again after today."

Ah! Wonderful news! There are more than a few who are rather tired of the takeover of this supposedly Libertarian blog by those who continually denounce and disparage others in the libertarian movement.

EXPERT SEZ: "Of course, since you never responded to my question to show me your list of great doings that you are responsible for or never answered my question about running for office yourself, I have to assume I've done more than you have, or you quickly would have answered those questions to shut me up....right?"

Nope.

First, I would never assume facts would "shut you up", as you say. No facts presented to you in the past have succeeded in doing so, and no facts presented in the future will do so, either.

Second, I am quite secure in my contributions to the LP. In fact, I am quite secure in the knowledge that you've got a long way to go in being an ACTIVE and PRODUCTIVE Libertarian volunteer compared to me.

Oh, and spending dozens of hours online every week writing insulting screeds on your own website and posting voluminous remarks on other blogs in your tar-and-feather campaign against other Libertarian activists DO NOT count as "active" or "productive".

EXPERT SEZ: "I sent out a fundraising letter to every LP member in the county, once before I ran, once after I started. I got exactly 2 replies..."

No big surprise there, expert. How many "members" (contributors to the national LP) were there in your county? Two?

I'll bet when you say "members" you're referring to "registered Libertarians" of which you said there are 70. Assuming that's true, the average fundraising appeal gets a 3% response rate. If you mailed to your 70 registered Libertarians, two or three responses would be about right.

Big surprise - you had never made any kind of contact with those registered Libertarians and therefore none of them knew you from Jack. Why would you expect them to drop cash on you?

I started a local LP many years ago and managed to get 9 out of 11 national LP members within the county to contribute to our committee - by knocking on their door, introducing myself, and inviting them to participate.

The fact that your fundraising letter tanked isn't evidence of expertise. Perhaps it simply makes obvious the fact that you simply didn't have what it takes to raise funds for your campaign.

EXPERT SEZ: "I made every novice mistake one could learn doing that race. Every one of them. It might interest you to know I was MUCH more "pure" in 2000 than I am today. I bet you would have supported me in every way. It was that experience that made me start questioning the LP's platform and general basis for fielding candidates in the first place."

So you ran little more than a paper campaign, you raised barely a dribble of money, you didn't assemble any volunteers to help you... and I'm tempted to ask what kind of name you've made for yourself in your county, but I think I can guess...

But the reason you failed was because of a platform written by others?

EXPERT SEZ: "There was an attempt ( not by me, though I was invited ) to organize a local LP about 8 months ago right in my county. Letters were sent out to every registered libertarian in the county. The meeting was on a Wed. night at a local restaurant. There was a grand total of ONE (1) couple that showed up."

So you didn't go?

EXPERT SEZ: "There are around 70 libertarians registered in my county."

OK, basic math class begins now. Feel free to take a course in statistics, too.

A county I used to live in had 40,000 residents. Republicans were by far the majority party. In the last several elections, the pool of registered voters has numbered about 25,000 people. Typically, 70% vote. Almost all races in the county go to Republicans. The vote totals for the Republicans are fairly consistently about 60-70%.

This means the reliable Republican voter base is about 10,000 votes.

I used to attend their local RP meetings. The LARGEST of their gatherings was their annual meeting. 150 people showed up at each of the three I attended. 150 of 10,000 is 1.5%.

If there are 70 registered Libertarian voters in your county, and two show up, that's 2.9% of your registered voter base.

Instead of whining about only two people showing up, one might perhaps be happy that our attendance rate is twice that of the RP, and go out and register more Libertarians (and ask them for donations).

EXPERT SEZ: "Frankly, my area seems to be a death trap for libertarians. All the efforts to do anything here have failed for years, and I have to admit I dont know why."

Precisely - you don't know why. Even so, you're willing to turn around and blame other Libertarians, and the platform, and the pledge, and other candidates -- for your own "I don't know".

Attitude is everything.

EXPERT SEZ: Until the LP can afford to buy the same actual political experts the R's and D's use for a few hundred dollars a hour, you will have to be satisfied with guys like me."

Actually, no one has to be satisfied with inexperience and unqualified advice at all.

You see, the LP used to have a really good talent pool of experts -- some of them major-party, highly-paid political gurus like you suggest - who went around the country to deliver first-class political training. This training was offered right up until about 2000 when amateur hour took over.

While the LP no longer sponsors those traveling teams, similar training is still available at reasonable cost at the Leadership Institute.

So -- no. We don't have to be satisfied at all with bad advice. Good and excellent advice is within reach of every LP member.

EXPERT SEZ: "The funniest thing about your attacks on me ... "

Who attacked anyone by name? I didn't. One who chooses to post drivel should expect counterpoint discussion. To then whine about being personally attacked is childish.

EXPERT SEZ: "... is that I have never claimed to any any sort of political expert of any kind, but you seem really upset that I might be taken seriously. I blog and give my opinions about what needs to be done. People either agree with me or they dont. You dont."

You are like a lot of other unqualified individuals who seek to run a national political party when they haven't successfully built one in their own back yard yet. There are hundreds of people just like you -- people who think they have God's Great Gift to the Party and who are righteously determined to purge the sinners who don't meekly toe the line.

EXPERT SEZ: "That does not bother me as much as you think it does. If you dont have a opposition, you are not having a impact. I must be doing something somewhere, enough to upset you, in any case. I've managed to upset some poeple so much they are sending me death threats.

Don't worry about me, expert, I have no interest in threatening anyone. Never have, never will. I'm an adherent of a well-known (pacifist) sect and I take seriously that credo. I've never intentionally hurt anyone.

EXPERT SEZ: "That would be pretty sicko if I find out they are coming from LP members. It's under criminal investigation."

Everyone has heard your complaints about threats you've allegedly received. Throwing that up in this discussion is intended to evoke... what? Sympathy? Suspicion?

Is it just your way of suggesting that anyone who disagrees with your expertise is somehow responsible for whatever threats you've received?

EXPERT SEZ: "Answer me here if you want, but this is the last you'll hear from me. It's gone on long enough already."

I agree.

The fact that genericized commentary about an anonymized ineffective activist got you so riled up is indicative of the fact that you spend way too much time monitoring this blog, attacking other LP volunteers, and worrying about what others are saying - which you perceive, whether rightly or wrongly, as being "about you".

I would fully encourage you to commit to a cease-fire against the other LP members you've made clear you dislike, and instead focus your efforts on talking - in person, not cocooned with your computer -- with your neighbors about the benefits of liberty.

Please don't forget all the pets that have been left behind and separated from their owners who need help! Donate to the rescue efforts for animals. No government funding is going to go to help them. A list of organizations helping in this effort may be found here: http://animal.discovery.com/features/katrina/links/links.html

I personally gave to the Humane Society of the US and the ASPCA.